OpenLaszlo Community Building!

One of the many features of Laszlo that has not gotten much attention (but my personal fave) is the persistent connection. A member of the community has just posted a tutorial on using that feature in a real app.

Very cool to see this kind of community building coming up so quickly. I guess the completeness of Laszlo's platform before opening it had something to do with that.

Another Cool Laszlo Blog Toy

Check out this infoblox demo quite nice.

Check out this infoblox demo quite nice.

Castro Toppled!

Hah! made you look :)

9/11 and Misconceptions.

Bush has been on the stump for a while now attacking Kerry for a "September 10th mentalisty". His point is that thw war on terror is a military action and that to believe otherwise is foolish.

This hadn't really sunk into me until today, but now that it has gotten into my thinking I've decided that Bush is truely delusional.

On September 12th 2001 someone asked me if I supported cutting the military now that we had been attacked. At the time I was arguing against the spending of trillions of dollars on a missile defense system that was designed to knock down ICBMs. I've always thought that theater defense was a sensible form of missile defense and that in the coming wars we should try to avoid them first, but that ICBMs were a threat of the past.

A trillion dollar missile defense system wouldn't have prevented 9/11. But that's not the point of today's rant. Today I ask what would have prevented 9/11?

Would a preemptive attack against Afaghanistan prevented 9/11? How about Invading Iraq, would that have done it?

So let's think here, and think clearly. Intelligence and police work would have prevented 9/11. The 9/11 commission said as much. This president is so committed to staying the course and justifying the means that he has completely convinced some people that right is wrong.

An interesting number I heard a while back, was 200. That's the number of FBI agents invloved with looking into the activities of the Clintons. Maybe two or tree of them could have returned phone calls to flight schools. Maybe a little police work would have prevented 9/11.

But this is not what we're talking about anymore. Bush says "With your help on Nov. 2, the people of America will reject the politics of fear, and vote for an agenda of hope and opportunity and security for all Americans," but the only thing he's peddling is fear. Fear of how the world will be destroyed by terrorists if he's not theman at the helm. Fear of rationed medicine if we dcreate a more universal heathcare system.

Ok enough. I'll come up with some neat LZX code to get my mind off these things...

brad's life - OpenLaszlo

brad's life - OpenLaszlo

SMUG: The rich web client platform is here...

SMUG: The rich web client platform is here...
"I hope that Macromedia is or can make Flex compatible with this so that you could buy their commercial versions or use the open source one(s)."

That will probably never happen. MM might create a new namespace in flex and support the LZX taks, but it would be a significant effort. The only gain they would get from that is the ability to port LZX -> MXML easily.

That's not a move I think you're likely to find many developers making though. MXML has a major weakness in that all of the components are still built in Flash.

Amazon.com: Books: A First Book of Morphy

Frisco Del Rosario has finally published his Chess book titlted A First Book of Morphy.

Frisco has been teaching chess since before I met him in 1996. Back then he was showing me my guts at Netrunner. We've stayed fairly close over the years, and even play Netrunner about twice a year. Frisco has injected an interest in Chess to myself and my kids.

I've not picked up a copy of his book yet, but I will and I'll have a review for both of my readers soon. Check it out for yourself:

Macromedia - Press Room

Macromedia - Press Room : MACROMEDIA FLEX CONTINUES RAPID CUSTOMER ADOPTION, VERSION 1.5 ANNOUNCED

oh yay. Can you yet build a component in MXML? Last I checked you still needed to do that inside Flash.

Have they solved the licensing issues with their components yet?

Can you point me to a single customer facing Flex site yet?

Does it run anywhere Laszlo doesn't?

Macromedia stretches Flex's features | CNET News.com

Macromedia stretches Flex's features | CNET News.com and the truth :)

Flex allows Java developers and other non-Flash professionals to work in a familiar text-based environment to create XML (Extensible Markup Language) code optimized for the Flash client software.

See how they neglect to mention that they don't support Flash versions below 7. Oh and also they forgot that there is no support for Linux or OSX in the Flex Builder.

Thanks go to ASVGuy for the link.

Domo arigato

Another link from Japan.

Babelfished:
The Laszlo Systems corporation announced the opening source conversion "of Laszlo platform".

"Laszlo platform" is the Flash contents formation system in the server side which is formed with contents below.

Laszlo Presentation Server
LZX language

Being free, can Laszlo platform, use commercial business/regardless of non commercial business.
Common Public License (CPL) in the origin, as an open source it can utilize.

Because Laszlo Presentation Server is the server of pure Java make, it can use with the environment where JRE 1.4 of Lunix/UNIX, Windows and Mac OS X etc. operates.

Simon Horwith's Blog

Simon Horwith's Blog

In the comments is another XUL reference... Sorry to have to say this again, but XUL will not catch on until Microsoft embraces (and extends) it. Of course when that happens it will be the battle of standards again. We all know how that turned out badly for Mozilla last time it happened.

I'm a long time Mozilla user and as much as I want it to be the browser of choice for a laundry list of reasons, IE is still there and still 95% of the browsing populace. Ignore that market at your own peril.

Maybe that's why there's so little commercial support for XUL...

Foo.Bar()

Foo.Bar()

Open Source Laszlo: A new age in RIAs? - frassle

Open Source Laszlo: A new age in RIAs? - frassle

SD Times: News & Top Stories

SD Times: News & Top Stories

Found page 15 :)

Looks like this was written before the October 5 announcement.

Outstanding quote:
“So we’ll be open source and Macromedia will be proprietary, and let the market figure it out,” Ciesinski said.

Wow! a CEO that "gets" it. Refreshing

SD Times: News & Top Stories

SD Times: News & Top Stories

Wow, more mainstream notice!

The list of names here is intense. David Temkin, Steve Ciesinski, Bill Weinberg, and Eric Raymond all on the same page :)

Of course we get the standard drivel from Rob Enderle, babbling about shared liability. I'm still trying to figure out what he's saying in this article.

Politics time...

So I'm reading CBS News | Kerry: Bush Could Renew Draft | October 16, 2004?07:09:25 and I come across this quote:
"In the final debate I talked about the vital link between education and jobs; the senator didn't seem to get it," Mr. Bush told supporters in Cedar Rapids.

Mr. Bush clearly doesn't get it.

Many of the jobs that are being outsourced and offshored are the types of jobs that require a higher education. Sure, if assembly jobs get offshored, we can retrain those people. Unfortunately those are not the only jobs that are moving overseas.

How are you going to tell someone with a Bachelor's or Master's degree to go to community college to retrain? Are we all supposed to become mechanics and ditchdiggers?

The problem with offshoring as it is happening in my industry is that the skill level and expertise of those losing work is at a level where Bush's retraining rhetoric doesn't apply.

Ian McMurray's WebBlog ? Open Laszlo

Ian McMurray's WebBlog ? Open Laszlo

w00t | Quickies ? Open Laszlo

w00t | Quickies ? Open Laszlo

...was wyrd ? In the hope of reading Kurt

...was wyrd ? In the hope of reading Kurt
Translation from German:
In the hope OF reading Kurt
Put down under

* Events
* Transformation
* Acceleration

around 12:42

While I enter myself by the morning Aggregatorenschlamm clicke and deliberately side paths, slowly a Futureflash swells to the necks highly. Laszlo presentation server since 4.Oktober open SOURCE. Ok one. force bar, although condemns fat WOW. Immediate Download on the waste dump. Braineinsatz if time. Ideas enough. 8 Clicks the far Flashstadtkarte from satellite photo with map overlay. Middle WOW. Differently suggestions that the employment by Laszlo within the education range already one angedacht somewhere. Place? North Rhine-Westphalia. Await.

Biological Flashback on my Blogworkshop in the DGB education center Hattingen. I think the information OVERFLOW fire hose of young humans into their brains I deliberately installed. There one - from the age bag generation perspective - grows up interesting subpopulation. Linux and Windows all the same. Use it and forget about it. However the suggestion of the acceleration of the technological Fortflashs does not produce still easy irritations (it is finally their future) this fundamentalist Armfuchteln as particularly with older rule humanistischer education degrees.

In the secondary room the Kurt Jansson and Wikimediaworkshoppte sat. Everyone knows the German Wikipedia. But everyone absolutely does not know Kurt. 2 meters, cool intelligently, Zwirbelbaertchen and first chairmen of the Wikimedia Germany. That is so degrees still tolerabel ; -), which I could not not let go through however was the shocking discovery the Kurt bloggt!! There does someone know times the dear Kurt Blogstalken or Stalkbloggen or Blogmaeeuten?

Tja, and then I would like to refer still to Guido bromine brook. Bears also two fire hoses. Thanks after Hattingen! At any time gladly again!

Keep an Open Eye ? Laszlo Goes Open Source

Keep an Open Eye ? Laszlo Goes Open Source

ANVL: Laszlo

ANVL: Laszlo

Sweet! Gallery Photoblox integration

Right on the front of ANVL

Laszlo wins the War

As I see more comments like this one:
White Noise: Laszlo vs Flex vs ???

I begin to feel the tide turning and the power of F/OSS overcoming the FUD and marketing money from big companies.

"The free non-commercial license may help build mindshare, but is meaningless to anyone but those just tinkering with no intention to deploy commercially."

You said it Jack, very astute observation.

There's smoething very nice about being able to build Flash applications in a natural (for me) way on a platform that is ignored by Macromedia.

Until I started using Laszlo, there was no way I could do any kind of development for the Flash plugin. So like every other Linux user I scorned and ignored it.

DigitalHobbit ? Laszlo

DigitalHobbit ? Laszlo

Cyblog notices Laszlo Demos

Cyblog

rootburn: "interesting" but also "somewhat desperate"

rootburn: "interesting" but also "somewhat desperate"

Too bad the comments on this site are disabled....

Marc's Voice: More folks grokking the significance of Laszlo going Open Source

Marc's Voice: More folks grokking the significance of Laszlo going Open Source

Marc Cantor has been keeping up on the F/OSS Laszlo thing too. Posting significant links as he finds them like this one from John McDowall's Fast Takes,

OpenLaszlo

OpenLaszlo gets a facelift! Looks nice.

Still missing that roadmap, though it's very good to know that it will be public.

Very very jazzed :)

Taking a look at Laszlo

If you're looking for an alternate set of instructions for building LPS from source. Take a look at this:
Taking a look at Laszlo

Engineering Rich Internet Applications: Rotating an Image

Engineering Rich Internet Applications: Rotating an Image

I have a response to the above article:

<canvas>

<view  resource="cd_cover.jpg" x="30" y="30" height="20" bgcolor="red"

     onmouseover="anim.pause(true);"

     onmouseout="anim.pause(false);">

 <animator name="anim" repeat="Infinity" attribute="rotation"

           duration="7200" from="0" to="360"

           motion="linear"/>

</view>

</canvas>

I don't know what a registration point is but I'd bet that it has something to do with the rotation point of that graphic. In that case, add:

xoffset="foo" yoffset="bar"

where foo and bar are integer values, to the view.

The fun that can be had here continues with this app:


That's 31 lines in LZX and 12 of them are for the trailing views...

Andrew Stopford's Weblog

Andrew Stopford's Weblog Has some great reading about the possible combinations of Laszlo and .Net:
Laszlo and the great .NET RIA drought
Laszlo and .NET pt1
Laszlo and .NET pt2

I do my own stunts -- Fabricio Zuardi: XML UI news

I do my own stunts -- Fabricio Zuardi: XML UI news

kSensei Notebook: Laszlo - Products

kSensei Notebook: Laszlo - Products

Jon Schull's Weblog: spontaneous integration

Jon Schull's Weblog: spontaneous integration

I'd like to see more thoughts on how these things fit together effectively. I have my thoughts of course.

Not Your Father's America: The Laszlo Platform

Not Your Father's America: The Laszlo Platform

Best Tool for the Job

Best Tool for the Job

Buried at the bottom is a note about the OSS strategy from Laszlo.

Laszlo

Laszlo

Laszlo Systems Secures $5 Million

The hits just keep on coming! Laszlo Systems Secures $5 Million in Venture Funding Led By New Investor Mitsui & Co. Venture Partners.

This even further validates the OSS move and looks to secure the bright future of the company.

phobia.com :: Journal/Technology/Laszlo opens for business

phobia.com :: Journal/Technology/Laszlo opens for business

Hugos House of Weblog Horror 8.10.2004

Hugos House of Weblog Horror 8.10.2004Laszlo - Products
In german... bablefish says:
Laszlo is the Prime Minister open SOURCE platform for the development and delivery OF rich InterNet applications on the World Wide Web. - ask which? The part is times posed to open under a SOURCE license straight and is to now already be equal to the "Prime Minister open SOURCE platform"? Zope, Drupal, Mambo, Typo3, Plone, Brickolage, Scoop, Xoom, Slash and like it all hot - those are thus all fancy? Apart from it LAMP is (unfortunately - I like neither MySQL nor PHP) probably the prominent platform, if one interprets platform in the usual sense.

Marketinghype held stop with the companies also in the open SOURCE introduction.

LordAlex 's MX Blog v1.3.4

LordAlex 's MX Blog v1.3.4

The Chaoszone Weblog ? Flex and Laszlo

The Chaoszone Weblog ? Flex and Laszlo

I should comment on this one...
Flex and Laszlo, while attractive, look like products whose windows of opportunity are closing – fast.

That assumes that Microsoft can ship anything on time. The window of opportunity for RIA without Microsoft is much wider than you think and for a couple of reasons:
* Apple isn't going away anytime soon and they are more likely to adopt an open standard than a Microsft one.
* Longhorn won't be available untin '06 or '07. Then it will take another 5 years to replace XP so looks like the window is maybe due to start closing in 2011.

Doesn't seem so fast to me

Ascription is an Anathema to any Enthusiasm ? Open Laszlo

Ascription is an Anathema to any Enthusiasm ? Open Laszlo

ranting ... again...

I've read the conversations here and have a little rant to get off my chest.

Here's what I wrote:

I'd like to respond to a couple of the points raised above. I'll rant on my blog :)

"GPL seems a better choice than CPL"
That all depends on who is most likely to embrace and extend your software. When making these choices you need to make sure that the license grants the proper freedoms to the community. Many believe that APL or BSD are better choices. CPL is a good compromise that doesn't rely on the shifting sands of "current copyright law" as the GPL does.

"But If I had purchased LPS at 2K a month before it went open source, I'd be quite angry."
Laszlo has quotes from their current customers who did pay for the software that counter your arguement. I'm sure that those customes take solace in the fact that they now know that the platform will continue to be supported and developed regardless of the business status of Laszlo.

You made a point about the changes created by open source and gratis software. The whole industry is changing and it has been for the last 15 years. Proprietary and closed source software came after open source. We just didn't call it that back then. Software was a science before it was a business.

There's been a recurring thing about this being a desparate move for Laszlo. They're hiring as was pointed out previously. The deparation seems to be coming more from Macromedia. Why else whould they choose to start giving away their product? They also chose a dubious day for it...

The histories and personalities of these two companies are intertwined. Macromedia obviously caught wind of Laszlo's move and tried to counter it.

Flex didn't win anything. Flex showed up to the game late and Laszlo just upped the stakes. When it comes to choosing a language now you have to decide on closed source mxml or open source lzx.

You also choose between Flash lockin for good or the potential for other runtimes. At this moment you choose between Flash 5,6, and 7 support or Flash 7 only.

Will Flex 2.0 support Flash 7? Or will Macromedia rev the player to support the new features, locking you into 8?

Then what about having to throw away everything when Microsoft locks you into XAML. It will take a few years, but all of the time and code invested in mxmxl will be tossed when you have to make *that* move. Laszlo's solution is designed to be future-proof.


And now for my rant:
I've let this one sit long enough...

I've been a long proponent of open source software and open source development. Up until recently, every company I've worked for adhered to the closed source proprietary methods of building software and making money. This model worked very well for a long time and brought us many software packages created to a quality level that was just good enough to sell.

The internet wasn't built that way. The web wasn't built that way. The core of the internet is open source. It follows that any technology that will change the landscape of the web will also be open source. This has been proven by the wide use of PHP, Apache, and Perl to create a dynamic web rather than a static one.

As a proprietary tool Flex will fill a niche (boutique?) market for those companies willing to pay for a platform and then pay for the staff to build applications on that platform. Laszlo now has the ability to focus its business on creating applications and supporting the continuing development a very powerful platform.

In case you havn't noticed, the only company that is really able to sell a proprietary platform is Microsoft. Even they have their problems with adoption (.Net anyone?).

Flex was a response to Laszlo. The NC license for Flex was a response to Laszlo. If Laszlo is desparate why are they leading this charge?

Let me back up a second. In order to have something like LPS or Flex adopted by a customer, you first need to convince them that they have a problem. Then you can show them that you have the solution and, oh by the way, you have a seven figure problem that justifies a six figure purchase.

Selling server licenses is a business model of the old school closed minded and closed sourced. In this day of ROI and outsourcing, IT departments are only willing to pay to keep things working. They're very conservative when it comes to spending. Many IT departments are penny wise but pound foolish also. How else can Microsoft convince people that Windows has a lower TCO than Linux?

There is a fundamental chicken and egg problem here. You can't sell a platform without demand, there's no demand unless there's adoption, there's no adoption if the price is too high, you can't make money without high prices, nobody will pay high prices for somthing that they don't have a demand for. So we go around for ever. One other thing to factor into this is the startup vs big company problem. Many customers are leery of purchasing core infrastructure from a small company that is dependent on VC money and building a market from scratch. The question inevitably becomes one of survival, and will this little company survive long enough for me to get the promised ROI? Many companies will wait and see what happens in the rest of the market. Open source breaks all of those cycles. There is no longer a fear that the platform will not be supported, nor is there the sticker shock of purchasing software license.

Laszlo understands the open source community, and business models. This is not a move of desparation, this is an opportunity to move the whole industry forward for the benefit of all. Developers now have the means and opportunity to explore this next generation of internet application without the shakles of old school development cycles. This move also allows the technology to be proven and fully vetted in the real world without charging users tons of money.

As for Macromedia's NC license, it's the carrot and the stick. You get the carrot now and the stick later. They are still locked into charging you for the privilege of supporting their platform. You get to pay for their sloppy work both by living with the bugs and inadequacies now and by charging you for an upgrade when it's in their best interest to fix those bugs.

I don't know about you, but I don't like being a slave.

Laszlo will make their money in different ways. They get to sell applications, training, support and professional services without the software license barrier. You developers get kick ass tools and real choice.

I'll admit to being colored, I've been fighting this fight for years. The names have changed but the fight is the same. I abandoned the use of commercial tools almost totally 6 years ago.

Do this, forget all about the cost. Look at both toolsets and choose based on their technical merits. The biggest difference until now was the name on the box.

Laszlo Open Sources Rich App Tool

Laszlo Open Sources Rich App Tool
One more mainstream press article. And this one doesn't have the dipshit analyst comment either :)

Lawrence Lessig kicking ass. - The Web 2.0 Weblog - web20.weblogsinc.com

Lawrence Lessig kicking ass. - The Web 2.0 Weblog - web20.weblogsinc.com

And thank you for helping make OpenLaszlo possible Larry.

Mark Roseman's Blog

Mark Roseman's Blog

Kevin Shannon

Kevin Shannon

Emptybottle : Coasters: Laszlo

Emptybottle : Coasters: Laszlo

Delimiter: October 2004 Archives

Delimiter: October 2004 Archives

Laszlo Goes Open Source

Laszlo Goes Open Source

Yep just an amazing coincidence. Like the fact that Laszlo doesn't show up on Christophe Coenraets resume.

Amazing coincidences abound.

Matthew Fusfield: FUS.NET: Way to go, Macromedia!

Matthew Fusfield: FUS.NET: Way to go, Macromedia!

History to be continually corrected. Laszlo builds lzx. Macromedia builds Flex. Laszlo open source. Macromedia hears about this, gives non commercial license of Flex to limited group.

In that order.

It takes months to open the source of a product like LPS. Writing a licese takes days.

Frequently Asked Questions about Caffeine

Frequently Asked Questions about Caffeine Handy Ceffeine FAQ

KahunaBurger: Laszlo

KahunaBurger: Laszlo
"who came up with this name anyway?"

One of the designers had a cat named Laszlo. My favorite references were from Casablanca and Real Genius.

If you look closely at the dashboard you can find references to them in the Contact list.

Boing Boing: Open source, no-plugin, rich GUIs for the Web

Boing Boing: Open source, no-plugin, rich GUIs for the Web

Boing Boinged? almost like a good slashdotting, but from a different crowd.

Now to get the suicide girls trained on laszlo...

Diary for jluke

Diary for jluke

compulsive.org

compulsive.org

Miguel de Icaza

Miguel de Icaza

Hey Miguel, any chance we could get some help compiling down to Mono?

BTW it's Laszlo not Lazlo :)

dev1: Open source Flex

dev1: Open source Flex

Why want CF when Tomcat and Jetty are Open Source?

Dave's Chalkboard

Dave's Chalkboard

Good Job Hui!

Hui's Blog

Always on the run: Laszlo, flash my demand

en espanol:Always on the run: Laszlo, flash my demand

en englais:


Laszlo, flash my demand
Reading blog at random, encontre Laszlo , framework on open source to generate flash the fly, is framework for applications Web, based on XML and in a language very similar to Javascript, to the loving aim it of the flash and "the new" experiences Web we have one more an option. Really this people deserve one more a more thorough evaluation of all his framework but dot than more promising. Here there is a Link of a cursito of 10 minutes. Laszlo-in-ten-make a draft.
I hope that they like. Today more flash than ever.

Rip747's Daily Life Lessons: Screw Flex, get Laszlo

Rip747's Daily Life Lessons: Screw Flex, get Laszlo

Forta.com - Blog

Forta.com - Blog

Funniest comment:
Just looked at Laszlo, OH MY GOD!!! My prayers were answered in a day! I'm going to be downloading it tonight and jerking around with it.

Forget shelling out 12 grand for Flex. This is the way to go.

rewindlife: Changing Export frame for classes requires unchecking Export in First Frame for components

rewindlife: Changing Export frame for classes requires unchecking Export in First Frame for components

Ok, this one took me by surprise. This article was linked in a comment in another blog regarding OpenLaszlo.

I've been building flash apps for two years now and never have I had to deal with a "frame". This article just proves the wisdom of LZX.

It's funny in a sad sort of way. I watched a co-worker spend 30 minutes trying to figure out how a flash movie worked in order to make a minor change. It ended up taking several iterations before the silly thing would work.

The debate is over by the way... Building applications using the Flash authoring tool is at an end.

Engineering Rich Internet Applications: Opinions: Flex and Laszlo

Engineering Rich Internet Applications: Opinions: Flex and Laszlo

We can agree to disagree.

ASVGuy::SWFBlog: Flex wins the first round!

ASVGuy::SWFBlog: Flex wins the first round!

Now where's my cluestick?

There would be no Flex if Laszlo hadn't beaten them to that punch by two full years.

Irrefragable: Open Laszlo

Irrefragable: Open Laszlo

Flash Ant: The Rich Internet Application Blog.

Flash Ant: The Rich Internet Application Blog.

myagent: Ever heard of Laszlo?

myagent: Ever heard of Laszlo?

Webmilhouse ? Free Flex License and Laszlo Open Source LPS 2.2

Webmilhouse ? Free Flex License and Laszlo Open Source LPS 2.2

Ted Shelton: Canter Pumps Laszlo

Ted Shelton: Canter Pumps Laszlo

Eccy Thump

Eccy Thump

BLOG IN BLACK: openlaszlo...

BLOG IN BLACK: openlaszlo...

Big Damn Heroes (MXBlogspace) : Laszlo Steps Ahead of Flex : 10-05-2004

Big Damn Heroes (MXBlogspace) : Laszlo Steps Ahead of Flex : 10-05-2004

Only quibble is that we've been building up to the open source announcement for months. Then macromedia decided to try and steal some thunder from us.

Just to be clear, Flex was a response to Laszlo (sort of a reFlexive response too). Buying Non-commercial Flex for free ($8.99) is a response to OpenLaszlo.

Laszlo open-sources their presentation server!

Laszlo open-sources their presentation server!

Bertrand's weblog: Open Laszlo

Bertrand's weblog: Open Laszlo

D'Arcy Norman @ The Learning Commons ? Blog Archive ? Laszlo Platform now open source

D'Arcy Norman @ The Learning Commons ? Blog Archive ? Laszlo Platform now open source

My CAN-I Thought Process!: Open Source Laszlo - RichWeb Platform

My CAN-I Thought Process!: Open Source Laszlo - RichWeb Platform

Raible Designs ~ We Build Web Apps

Raible Designs ~ We Build Web Apps

Flash Ant: The Rich Internet Application Blog. :: Open Source Laszlo: A new age in RIAs?

Flash Ant: The Rich Internet Application Blog. :: Open Source Laszlo: A new age in RIAs?

The Fair And Biased Blog: Java based RIAs with Laszlo

The Fair And Biased Blog: Java based RIAs with Laszlo

One point, Flex came AFTER Laszlo had a second generation product.

"Sound just like Flex?"

We said the same thing when we heard about "Royale" it sounded just like LPS.

Dan's Diatribe

Dan's Diatribe Short and sweet :)

Play with the Machine: Laszlo goes open source

Play with the Machine: Laszlo goes open source

Business Club To innovate To undertake - Notebooks of the BCIE

Business Club To innovate To undertake - Notebooks of the BCIE (translated) Original Content

inside looking out: Laszlo. Open. Source.

inside looking out: Laszlo. Open. Source.

but aandy's already a fan...

Andrew Wooldridge Dot Com thinks this is "great news"

He's in good company

Flex is free. And Laszlo is Open Source

enterFrame: Flex is free. And Laszlo is Open Source

And yet this blogger would choose Laszlo... Warms my heart.

Macromedia - Press Room

Macromedia - Press Room : MACROMEDIA OFFERS NEW NON-COMMERCIAL LICENSE OPTION FOR FLEX

Typical of Macromedia, they copied much of LPS and failed to get it right. Now they try to copy our open source announcement and can't get it right.

If you look into it, you see where they want to nail you: frm the FAQ: Participants also receive 1 license of Macromedia Flex Builder, the Macromedia IDE for Flex.

But you still need to pay for additional developer tools. IF you qualify.

I also noted that they're trying to attract bloggers.

Blog this!

Mainstream press and punt the pundit!

EWeek picked up the story Laszlo Open-Sources App-Building Platform.

Buried in there is an interesting quote:
Ronald Schmelzer, an analyst with ZapThink LLC, in Waltham, Mass., called Laszlo's decision "interesting" but also "somewhat desperate." Schmelzer said, "The issue is that Macromedia is the real juggernaut here. Their Flex product is going to significantly impact the market for rich client technology, and it's hard to see how a startup can effectively compete against a company with 98-percent penetration on the desktop and millions of developer customers."

Flex has 98% wow! I think Ronald is missing the point a bit. Laszlo competes with Flex on the server side. Though it would be safer to say Flex competes with Laszlo since LPS is in its second generation with high profile deployments at places like Earthlink, Behr, LaQuinta, and Yahoo. To date Flex is deployed on exactly one public facing site.

Macromedia has millions of developer customers for their whole product line, not Flex.

Schmelzer said open source should not be viewed as a panacea. "Startups now think that open source is the magic bullet that somehow helps them avoid having to effectively sell and market their product. There are two fallacies with this thought. First, that open source means free. If it's free, then open source by definition isn't a business model.

If selling servers and per-cpu licenses are your business model then you'd be a fool to open souce your crown jewels. If open souce is the wrong way to go why is Microsoft desparately trying to be a part of it? Why is Solaris 10 due to be Open source? Why is Java due to be open source? Business changes, Laszlo figured out that we couldn't compete aginst the marketing dollars and "juggernaut" staus and instead we're focussing on our core strengths of building the best web deployed, rich client applications avaialble.

If it's not free, then you still have to sell it. Second, why would a developer want to put their time and effort into developing a Flash-based application that has a limited market when you can spend the same amount of time developing on top of a platform that already has millions of users?

Now we really see that he doesn't get it. Why would a developer want to spend tens of thousands of dollars to to put their time and effort into developing a Flash-based application that has a limited market when you can spend the same amount of time developing on top of a platform that already has millions of users?

See here, Flex runs on Flash 7 only. You're more limited in the penetration with Flex than with Laszlo. Ronald didn't do his homework.
"Fundamentally, Laszlo will have to compete directly with Macromedia for Flash-based rich clients. They only way they can survive is to produce a well-differentiated value proposition for both end-user customers and developers. Open source doesn't do anything to help that value proposition."

Looks like we have another pundit that doesn't understand open source at all, and our space even less.

The blogosphere is noticing :)

techno.blog("Dion") permalink

From the CTO

davidtemkin.com is always worth reading, but today he has
something very special to write about.
One of my favorite lines:
"This made a lot of sense in the context of the old software industry model: per-CPU licensing, enterprise sales contracts, vendor lock-in, closed, proprietary code, limited interoperability, source code escrow, and more."
Weveryone welcome Laszlo to the new software industry, and be reborn!

Laszlo - Web Innovator Laszlo Systems Unveils Open Source Stra...

The best news all year: Web Innovator Laszlo Systems Unveils Open Source Strategy for Rich Client Platform.

I've been an advocate of open source here and this move by Laszlo will lay the foundation for a real Web 2.0. The internet was built on open source and continues to run on primarily open source technologies.

Laszlo has taken the bold step of proving that we are committed to building the "Next Generation Internet" by open sourcing the platform that makes it possible. Other platform companies spend so much of theit time trying to prove that they have the technology to change the world. Now that the platform is open we can get to the real work of building out those apps.

Just my humble opinion.

More links to come, this is going to be fun.